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Kev C
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Scary Stuff

Post by Kev C » 13 Nov 2013 19:00

When my legs hurt, I say: "Shut up legs! Do what I tell you to do!" ~ Jens Voigt

rdleaper
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Post by rdleaper » 15 Nov 2013 00:13

5 in 9 days now; another one last night :(

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-24936942

Looks like a run of bad luck as relatively few in previous months; maybe darker nights are the problem? Shouldn't really speculate without knowing more about circumstances though.

Tim
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Post by Tim » 15 Nov 2013 06:09

And it makes you think is it any safer in Birmingham where 1 a year is killed compared to 15 a year in London. I would say there are more than 15times the number of cyclists in London.

Although I may be wrong but it seems there are many more cyclists now than a year ago commuting in Birmingham and many with much better lights and high viz jackets. Whilst numbers are increasing there are bound to be more collisions doesn't mean it's more dangerous

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GrahamGamblin
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Post by GrahamGamblin » 15 Nov 2013 11:00

You're right, Tim, there do seem to be a lot more well-lit cyclists - but I since the clocks changed, I have also seen every evening at least one person cycling in rush-hour traffic without lights. I also notice every year at this time an increase in bad driver behaviour, specifically short-cutting through "bus and cycle only" lanes. Not sure whether they think no-one will notice in the dark, or if the dark makes them want to get home quicker? (It also happens in heavy rain, bizzarely.) So I do think that the dark evenings makes a difference, but it's not just about cyclists' visibility, there are some drivers who are not taking the extra care required in low light conditions. While I do think that it is incumbent upon cyclists to ride carefully, I don't think Boris Johnson's comments are very helpful http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2013 ... ing-deaths He does seem to imply that cyclists are engaging in risky behaviour while everyone else is following the rules. I think we all know that to be nonsense, and the fact is that a minority of all types of road user make bad decisions or take unnecessary risks.
I should add that my comments are not referring to the London incidents, but my general experience in Brum. The number of recent deaths in London does make you wonder whether there is something more systemic going wrong though, especially at the big junctions.
Graham

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Philip Whiteman
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Post by Philip Whiteman » 15 Nov 2013 13:21

GrahamGamblin wrote:..... The number of recent deaths in London does make you wonder whether there is something more systemic going wrong though, especially at the big junctions.
Earlier this year I was talking with an experienced London cycling commuter. He claimed that London cyclists are less savvy in terms of the rules of the road. To put it bluntly, he claimed that London cyclists are not totally innocent and vehicle drivers are not wholly guilty where accidents occur. A high proportion of Londoners do not possess a license nor have they undergone driver training due to the prevalence of public transport. As a consequence, many London cyclists are unleashed onto the roads without any recognition of dangers or rules of the road.

I have read that a high number of collisions in London involve cyclists undertaking HGVs, especially at LH turn junctions resulting in crush injuries when the vehicle starts to move. I'm sorry, but anyone undertaking such an manoeuvre of undertaking a HGV is a dangerous activity and should be avoided at all cost.

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Philip Whiteman
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Post by Philip Whiteman » 18 Nov 2013 15:04


Andy_Craddock
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Post by Andy_Craddock » 18 Nov 2013 15:37

Philip Whiteman wrote:
GrahamGamblin wrote:..... The number of recent deaths in London does make you wonder whether there is something more systemic going wrong though, especially at the big junctions.
Earlier this year I was talking with an experienced London cycling commuter. He claimed that London cyclists are less savvy in terms of the rules of the road. To put it bluntly, he claimed that London cyclists are not totally innocent and vehicle drivers are not wholly guilty where accidents occur. A high proportion of Londoners do not possess a license nor have they undergone driver training due to the prevalence of public transport. As a consequence, many London cyclists are unleashed onto the roads without any recognition of dangers or rules of the road.

I have read that a high number of collisions in London involve cyclists undertaking HGVs, especially at LH turn junctions resulting in crush injuries when the vehicle starts to move. I'm sorry, but anyone undertaking such an manoeuvre of undertaking a HGV is a dangerous activity and should be avoided at all cost.
I personally think anyone using the roads should have some sort of test on the "rules of the road". I seriously think if I didn't drive then I would have been hit quite a few times due to people's bad driving. It is only from reading the road ahead and anticipating what the driver is going to do I have avoided n accident.

I see lots of people riding all in black with no lights.

I also tend to watch people at junctions to see their actions. I had to stop my friend I was cycling with once when we were at an island going straight on. He was about to go and I shouted at him to stop. The car wasn't indicating but seeing their hands on the steering wheel and the passenger pointing I knew they were going to turn, which the did just that and we're oblivious to us.

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